Defense Minister Lee Jye (李傑) told the Legislature on Tuesday that just after the 2004 presidential elections, he was asked in private to "feign sickness in order to achieve public disquiet," a disclosure that suggested President Chen Shui-bian's (陳水扁) allegation of a "soft coup d'etat" attempt by the opposition was not groundless.
Lee, then head of the Bureau of General Staff for Intelligence in the Ministry of National Defense in 2004, said on Tuesday that on March 24, 2004 -- four days after Chen was reelected -- he "was visited by two retired military officials who were obviously from the opposition pan-blue alliance," said Lee.
"They asked me to claim to be sick, as (former Defense Minister) Tang Yiau-ming (湯曜明) had done," said Lee said, recalling that Tang, then minister of defense, was at the time hospitalized with an eye disease.
But, Lee said, the two officials did not say they were representing the pan-blue presidential candidate Lien Chan (連戰) and his running mate James Soong (宋楚瑜). Lee refused to go into any further details on the grounds that the case is now in court, but his statement supported Tuesday's front page story in the pro-independence Liberty Times, which gave details of the episode as recounted in written testimony prepared by the MND for the Taiwan High Court.
The court began a second trial Monday in a defamation suit filed by Lien and Soong against Chen over the president's remark that there had been a "soft coup" attempt after the 2004 presidential election.
The newspaper report said that a strategic adviser visited Lee on March 24, 2004 to ask him to "fake sickness so as to be admitted to a hospital," at a time when then-Defense Minister Tang was hospitalized with an eye disease.
The move was reportedly aimed at putting pressure on Chen's administration, as a group of "pan-blue" supporters staged massive demonstrations in Taipei against what they called an unfair election, and demanded a recount.
The purpose of the military-Blue cooperation was to negate the legitimacy of the Chen election. Now we have Blue mobs in the streets demanding that the President step down because he is "corrupt." A set up? Last time we had Blue mobs in the streets, we apparently had Blue offiicers cooperating with them. Hopefully the Thais won't give the radical Blues in the military any bright ideas this time around.
[Taiwan]
Relax, Michael. At first, I was alarmed, too.
ReplyDeleteWhen you really think about it, though, the coup was long overdue. The military commander is doing it, I think, not out of opportunism, but out of a sense of responsibility. Thai's Prime Minister is like so many of these Western/American propped leader/dictators, who are bribed by you name it: the NSA, CIA, multinational corporations, to buy projects that run their countries into the ground, while providing women, money, power, anything to the pseudo democracy's corrupt leaders.
I don't think we have another Musharaff in the making here. Thailand has a much stabler history of democracy. And like some places in South America, has relied on military coups to weed out the corruption. I don't think we have another Pinochet or Musharaff. Not even a Chavez, for that matter. I myself, for the most part, like Chavez. But what's happening in Thailand is merely an expression of the people's dissatisfaction and imminent instability. Maybe things would be much better, in the Philippinnes, too, if they got rid of Arroyo in similar way.
A multi-millionaire skimming more and more money off the public for his families disgusting indulgences. Thaksin Go Away indeed! The people have spoken. Thank goodness the military is on the side of the people this time.
"Blue" mobs in the streets?! How absurd. The RED people are variously green and blue ideologically but are equally fed up with A-bian's corruption and incompetence. And the hooligans arrested last night for violence and trouble-making in Tainan and Ping-tung were neither blue nor red, but.......yup!
ReplyDelete"Blue" mobs in the streets?! How absurd.
ReplyDeleteLOL. The pro-Blue mobs in Taipei, I should have said.
Michael
Ah, taiwanindependence's comment or reaction to my comment shows a great deal of naivete on his or her part.
ReplyDelete1.
TaiwanIndependence said...
"Actually the coup was baseless. Its a little more than a month from the elections in Thailand, if some leading members of the military felt there needed a change in Presidency then they could've waited for the election. But they didn't and hijacked the government."
Thaksin's very reason for being able to stay in power for so long is due to his control of the media. There was even a reality show about his day to day life. How much more perverse and self-indulgent can you get. Those traits in themselves aren't crimes, but taking money out of the country, enriching your family, and leaving millions and millions of your countrymen in dire poverty to further enrich your grandiose lifestyle is. Independent media in Thailand? Give me a break. TaiwanIndependence, tell me another one. Absurd, when a Prime Minister or President owns or controls the media. Other examples include, as I said, Thailand, Italy (until Berlusconi fell on his butt), Russia (oh, Putin now, after now Putin and Russia will be synonymous), and well, well...the Bush family and the U.S.A. But I presume you and I come from different ideological camps, TaiwanIndependence, when it comes to international issues and issues of left and right (or even right or wrong, for that matter).
2. TaiwanIndependence said...
"The democratic constitution was even thrown out."
Yes, and what of it? Why was it thrown out? Why don't you ask yourself this question?
It was thrown out because Thaksin abused the constition. He stretched it, shaped it and altered interpretations of it for his own selfish ends. Just remember, the people, the Thai ordinary people, from the poor to the middle class (maybe not the superrich like Thaksin) greeted the coup with open arms. It was a bloodless coup and the provisional authority is just temporary. Thaksin has managed to buddy up to the powerful, the rich and the elite of the nations of the North, the Bush's, the Blairs, etc.
3. TaiwanIndependence said...
"Finally the way the news reports have been going on in English written media seem to have no context of the history of all these allegations."
Can you be any more vague than you are being TaiwanIndependence? You are speaking of the English media as some monolithic blob out to eradicate whatever unformed opinion I don't even know you are stating. In Taiwan, the English media is very slim indeed. Taiwan has few official diplomatic ties with other countries, so yes, reporting in Taiwan is often not high quality. Thailand is a different situation altogether. And if you think I am just getting my reporting from CNN, you are dead wrong. I read Al Jazeera, BBC, Reuters, and thousands of other journals that crop up that might suit my fancy. Just because the media doesn't report well in Taiwan, doesn't mean the media might now report your "way," whatever slant that is (again, you are being so vague I'm not sure it's worth responding).
I don't believe Chen is entirely faultless.
And yet, I don't think I want Ma in power. The same goes for Annette Lu, who doesn't seem terribly trustworthy or ethical or accountable in his spirit or manner of dealing with the public. I much prefer Chen for now. He isn't attacking democracy. There were much worse scandals in Canada before Harper's Conservative's beat Martin's liberals in a narrow minority government.
Thoth:
ReplyDeleteThe fact that you like Chavez is pretty disturbing. From your description, you seem to support any leftist government REGARDLESS of their means to power.
It's telling that you say that the Thai media was controlled by the government, but you can tolerate a military coup that throws all civil liberties out the window and where you aren't even allowed to meet in groups of more than 5.
Chavez is the same. He has not been "a nice guy" to his opposition, and if you're really so good at reading news all around, then I suggest you read about those problems in his country.
You might also try to read about his destruction of Venezuala's oil fields. I think it'd be better if the wealth from the country's natural resources were distributed more evenly, but destroying the fields? What is he thinking?
Military coups don't usually end with a good result. It is in the long-run, destabilizing to the country. Sure, maybe you get rid of one corrupt guy. But you set an incredibly, incredibly bad precedent. Next time it's not corruption, but it's just that maybe the military just really doesn't like the guy. The top military commanders will have a much lower barrier for attempting another coup.
And since actually, there's always corruption, it'd be pretty easy to find SOME issue to use as cover for the removal of the prime minister.
Notice lastly, that we've come pretty close to a description of Taiwan... significant amounts of public unrest... a military that's pro-opposition... corruption scandals... be brave now--apply the same standard. Using the same reasoning--what's the answer in Taiwan?
In response to anonymous:
ReplyDeleteanonymous said:
The fact that you like Chavez is pretty disturbing. From your description, you seem to support any leftist government REGARDLESS of their means to power.
I just love people who sign their opinionated comments as anonymous when they attack a person's political sensibilities. Like so many Chavezaphobes, you don't state the detailed accounts for your reasoning. What is this REGARDLESS you state? I have read some of the other accounts of life under Chavez. Since your comment is something of an attack on my sensibilities and I have absolutely no idea of who you are, I'll leave it at that. I'll just make the same smug assertion as Ambassasador John Bolton made in reaction to Chavez speech at the U.N.: "I have more inmportant things to do."
And I do. I didn't put my comments on here to attack anyone. I have many friends who like Chavez. They are intelligent, sensitive people.
Your comments about life under Chavez are pretty fuzzy in their assumptions. They have the same standing as Bolton's remarks that people under Chavez don't have the same freedom of speech as he does. From what authority or knowledge are you making such an assumption, sir or madame? There have been allegations, yes, but there are far more allegations under regimes in the West, under the horrid Patriot Act, under the suspensions of civil liberties in G.B. if you happen to be a Muslim living in a Muslim neighbourhood in London. I have a friend from Veneuzuela and her family is from Venezuela. From what I can see, the allegations about Venezuela that you make are propaganda by a very powerful and very sinister propaganda machine, from the American State Department, and possibly the CIA and the NSA.
You are also making an awful lot of assumptions about me, Anonymous. I don't have too much time on my hands. I just wanted to make more or less positive and optimistic commments. Please let us agree to disagree. You have made your arguments and I have made mine. I don't agree with most military juntas as a rule, either, whether it be Chile's Pinochet, etc. The latter example is particuarly horrid. Read the fact, all of you, on Allende's overthrow and the despicable Pinochet regime.
What are you talking about? Destruction of the oil fields? He has redistributed his countries wealth. Why would he desroy the oil fields? Your comments are very strange.
Okay, that's all the time I have. Go to go now.
The possibility of Taiwan Army coup is probably slim due to the success of the "army state-owned" policy enforced by an-bian's government.
ReplyDeleteThe possibility of "police coup" could be much higher. As discussed in this site:
http://www.anti-media.tw/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=15655
Some policemen did their duty to maintain safety of citizens against the possible violence of anti-bianers during their office hours. After their office hours, they took of police uniforms, replace with red shirts, went join the anti-bianers.
How can policemen carry out law enforcement, when they see their colleges are among the people who exercise the violence ?
TaiwanIndependence, both your and my opinions are based on very little knowledge so far, with all due respect. It is good that you are questioning and considering both sides of the issue, as am I. Sometimes I wonder if it wouldn't be better if Bush was deposed by more ethical military commanders for a temporary term.
ReplyDeleteYou have some good points, TaiwanIndependence, but be fair, you haven't provide any sources for your "facts," either. Let's face it. We're both waiting to see what happens. I have an ex-colleague who went over there just before I started this job in Fongyuan. I'm sure he's okay. It's not an anti-foreign government. And the people were fed up with Thaksin's mismanagement.