tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post6458504551669650117..comments2023-10-22T18:25:39.688+08:00Comments on The View from Taiwan: One FEER, Two TaiwansMichael Turtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-47828221086888225932009-02-11T19:08:00.000+08:002009-02-11T19:08:00.000+08:00Anyone can understand that--every nation has to lo...Anyone can understand that--every nation has to look after its interests. But Arias couldn't help knocking Taiwan, as the International Business Times explained in an article titled "Costa Rica criticizes Taiwan as stingy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-2531936014599697732008-12-11T03:04:00.000+08:002008-12-11T03:04:00.000+08:00Michael wrote:- - -[...] so awful, so totally unco...Michael wrote:<BR/>- - -<BR/><I>[...] so awful, so totally unconsidered, so utterly uninformed about reality on The Beautiful Isle, you can hardly believe that a major news magazine printed it.</I><BR/>- - -<BR/><BR/>If he were a conservative he would be completely unsurprised. Major news magazines regularly right articles that are awful, unconsidered, and uninformed. It's just what they do.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-40834186365354318772008-12-10T16:45:00.000+08:002008-12-10T16:45:00.000+08:00KMT was a separate organism in 1949 but as we all ...KMT was a separate organism in 1949 but as we all know is now organically connected to the Han body that is a part of the ethnic Taiwanese population.<BR/><BR/>In that light, we must accept the fact that those 'by products' or intermingled Taiwanese offspring are going to have mixed feelings about all things Taiwanese.<BR/><BR/>To berate the KMT is understandable. To see the activities of old soldier's offspring in the true light of their criminal activities is also understandable.<BR/><BR/>Chiang was a dope dealer. That legacy continues and Taiwan is a major transit for the dope from the golden triangle where the KMT generated much of their operating capital.<BR/><BR/>All of that is a part of Taiwan.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-44184747158798324522008-12-10T11:16:00.000+08:002008-12-10T11:16:00.000+08:00Something to watch for... I have noticed a few new...Something to watch for... I have noticed a few news outlets reported that the people attacking Zhang were from the "opposition DPP". <BR/><BR/>Journalists need to be sure to avoid equating any anti-KMT or anti China action as being DPP. I don't think there was any evidence which linked the protesters directly to the party.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-58646872105748569232008-12-10T02:36:00.000+08:002008-12-10T02:36:00.000+08:00A follow-up to my earlier comment...The thing I me...A follow-up to <A HREF="http://michaelturton.blogspot.com/2008/12/one-feer-two-taiwans.html?showComment=1228750260000#comment-1075462209608628783" REL="nofollow" TITLE="''I'll post another comment if I can narrow down...''">my earlier comment</A>...<BR/><BR/>The thing I mentioned about <I>Talking Show</I> (大話新聞) starts at the 7:52 mark in <A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnxg8mx1XQE&feature=PlayList&p=2FFBD1AE6D9E6943&index=3" REL="nofollow" TITLE="2008-12-06 DaHwa 2b">this part</A>. And to correct what I said earlier, it wasn't from a text message to Cheng Hung-yi, but rather many blue media sources quoting a single blue media source which is, according to Cheng, "very loyal to the Ma government" (效忠馬英九的政府).<BR/><BR/>Just like with the Copper piece, that's the way they do it.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://taiwanmatters.blogspot.com/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="Taiwan Matters!">Tim Maddog</A>Tim Maddoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16943522529132663780noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-86005895140026120912008-12-09T22:22:00.000+08:002008-12-09T22:22:00.000+08:00Stop Ma said: either someone gave the reporters th...Stop Ma said: <B>either someone gave the reporters the wrong information, or they are making things up out of thin air.</B><BR/><BR/>Or, their all about to be arrested for illegal assembly...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-13793591691653337672008-12-09T13:05:00.000+08:002008-12-09T13:05:00.000+08:00This is why the China Times group can't make money...This is why the China Times group can't make money. The bother putting out this kind of garbage. The good news is they lose so much money each year that it is becoming unsustainable...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-89609417111237294042008-12-09T11:26:00.000+08:002008-12-09T11:26:00.000+08:00"It has driven a wedge between the Chinese mainlan..."It has driven a wedge between the Chinese mainland and Taiwan by instilling hatred for mainland Chinese in the hearts and minds of Chinese on Taiwan."<BR/>OMG, this sounds like it was taken straight out of the People's Daily.<BR/>That's exactly why I hate that stupid blue rag the China Post. Not only are all their wire reports full of spelling and grammar errors for some bizarre reason, but they always take petty swipes at A-bian or his family, which gets really tiresome. Take this recent article for an example. They go out of their way to insinuate that Chen was elected by a fluke - even though it has absolutely nothing to do with the article.<BR/>http://www.chinapost.com.tw/taiwan/national/national-news/2008/11/05/181755/Another%2DChen.htm<BR/>After Chen was elected as Taipei mayor, helped by the splitting of votes for two candidates in the Kuomintang camp, Ma successively held the positions as director of the Mayor's office, chief of the Department of Information, and deputy secretary general of the Taipei City Government. <BR/>After Chen won the presidential election in 2000 again due to the division of the KMT, Ma became director of the president's office and was later promoted to deputy presidential secretary general.<BR/><BR/>As the China Times was the only newspaper to exist through the Martial Law era there's not much doubt about which color Kool Aid they constantly spew.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-31463596170276332592008-12-09T10:21:00.000+08:002008-12-09T10:21:00.000+08:00"I think Mr. Copper is one of those that has diffi..."I think Mr. Copper is one of those that has difficulty changing his habit of thoughts, thus the distorted view I think."<BR/><BR/>Hmm... I don't think that describes it. It is one thing to let fall a "Chinese" here or there, but it is quite another to promote the KMT myths that the DPP wrecked the economy, was nightmarish in terms of ethnic politics, and provoked China and to imply that people in southern Taiwan are simply less civilised. This guy's writing reads like something out of the China Post. Then again, it pains me to note that many still think that the China Post is a reliable source. For example, Realclearpolitics and Realclearworld both regularly add China Post articles and editorials to their headline lists.Tommyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13552370490869601403noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-1509905488820692132008-12-09T09:24:00.000+08:002008-12-09T09:24:00.000+08:00The China Post seems to have a different opinion r...The China Post seems to have a different opinion re the Presbyterian Church than Julian Baum:<BR/><BR/>"The Presbyterian Church on Taiwan has been meddling in China’s domestic politics for nearly a century. It has driven a wedge between the Chinese mainland and Taiwan by instilling hatred for mainland Chinese in the hearts and minds of Chinese on Taiwan. In their fanatical quest to divide China, pastors of the Presbyterian Church have even advocated violating the Ninth Commandment, which states: “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.""<BR/><BR/>You can read the whole hate-filled editorial here (including references to the KKK and Nazis):<BR/>http://www.chinapost.com.tw/editorial/taiwan-issues/2008/12/06/186385/p2/Independence-movement%E2%80%99s.htmAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-54432621894845244502008-12-09T06:24:00.000+08:002008-12-09T06:24:00.000+08:00If you look in John Copper's references, you'll no...If you look in John Copper's references, you'll notice the majority of his citation are either from the various publications from the GIO... or himself.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-10754622096086287832008-12-09T06:15:00.000+08:002008-12-09T06:15:00.000+08:00Michael wrote:- - -[...] so awful, so totally unco...Michael wrote:<BR/>- - -<BR/>[...] <I>so awful, so totally unconsidered, so utterly uninformed about reality on The Beautiful Isle, you can hardly believe that a major news magazine printed it.</I><BR/>- - -<BR/><BR/>It's easy to believe. All you have to do is understand that some people get paid -- by someone with an agenda and a set of talking points -- to write that kind of stuff. <I>That</I> is just about the only thing that would explain the "lack of context," the "stream of factual errors," the "quasiethnic slur," and more.<BR/><BR/>But you also wrote:<BR/>- - -<BR/><I>It's arguable whether the local DPP politician pushed Zhang to the ground</I> [...]<BR/>- - -<BR/><BR/>I don't think it's arguable. Wang Ting-yu helped Zhang up. It's pretty clear he didn't push him.<BR/><BR/>Notice, too, that the <I>IHT</I> piece is really an AP piece (which the <I>Taiwan News</I> <A HREF="http://www.taiwannews.com.tw/etn/news_content.php?id=805768&lang=eng_news&cate_img=&cate_rss=news_Society_TAIWAN&pg=4" REL="nofollow" TITLE="'Thousands turn out for Wild Strawberries demo in Taiwan'">also carried</A>). Since it has no byline, we can only wonder who wrote it.<BR/><BR/>Regarding the supposed halting of the sit-in, <I>Talking Show</I> (大話新聞) host Cheng Hung-yi (鄭弘儀) <A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=2FFBD1AE6D9E6943" REL="nofollow" TITLE="Playlist for the whole show, via Taiwan560">said on Saturday night</A> that he got a text message from somebody in the blue media (he didn't name the person) making that claim and that a spokesperson for the Wild StrawBerries denied it. (I'll post another comment if I can narrow down where in the show he talked about it.)<BR/><BR/>As far as the number of protesters, check out <A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8S5b1yslz6A" REL="nofollow" TITLE="1207strawberry.mov">this video/slideshow</A> and see what fraction of the crowd "3,000" is. There's a nice shot of the crowd at the 4:35 mark if you don't want to watch the whole thing.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://taiwanmatters.blogspot.com/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="Taiwan Matters!">Tim Maddog</A>Tim Maddoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16943522529132663780noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-20936307304886583112008-12-09T03:34:00.000+08:002008-12-09T03:34:00.000+08:00All I have to say to Copper is this.In case that's...All I have to say to Copper is <A HREF="http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/photo/2008/12/09/2008032896" REL="nofollow">this</A>.<BR/><BR/>In case that's not clear or your misled by the caption, see <A HREF="http://www.ooze.com/finger/assets/images/sidevanfa.jpg" REL="nofollow">this</A>.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-46457476019684377242008-12-09T03:08:00.000+08:002008-12-09T03:08:00.000+08:00hmm...i think sometimes it's just can't be helped....hmm...i think sometimes it's just can't be helped. a lot of older people have much harder time changing their views. For example two 40-ish friend of mine still call me Chinese sometimes after I told them it's better if he call and consider me Taiwanese. They don't mean ill intention and I can understand when they are little they probably never heard of Taiwan and consider everyone from Taiwan Chinese. Back then even most people in Taiwan think themselves Chinese and think ROC represent China, due to KMT education and policy. Younger people have less problem changing their view and habit of thoughts.<BR/><BR/>I think Mr. Copper is one of those that has difficulty changing his habit of thoughts, thus the distorted view I think. Hopefully the newer generations can have better understanding.Dixteelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05689510846926854542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-43729985226810710462008-12-09T00:21:00.000+08:002008-12-09T00:21:00.000+08:00...Michael, In that news about the Wild Strawberri....<BR/>.<BR/>.<BR/>Michael, <BR/><BR/>In that news about the Wild Strawberries were factual errors as well. I'll quote the International Herald Tribune first:<BR/><BR/><B>They have agreed to halt the protests after Sunday's demonstration because lawmakers said they would debate the issue in the Legislature.</B><BR/><BR/>And now the China Post,<BR/><BR/><B>Students end sit-in with demonstration<BR/><BR/>College students demanding the right to hold public demonstrations without restrictions decided to end their month-long sit-in after staging a march in Taipei yesterday. <BR/>.<BR/>.<BR/>.<BR/>They agreed yesterday to halt the sit-in protests at the Liberty Square in the Chiang Kai-shek Memorial Park. <BR/><BR/>Student leaders said they will pull out from the square and concentrate on working out new tactics to continue pushing their cause. <BR/></B><BR/><BR/>This is completely false. The Wild Strawberries did not halt the sit-in on Sunday. So, either someone gave the reporters the wrong information, or they are making things up out of thin air.<BR/><BR/>.<BR/>.<BR/>.skiingkowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05381159852660053893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-31304722419456657372008-12-08T23:35:00.000+08:002008-12-08T23:35:00.000+08:00The concert on Tuesday night is at Freedom Square....The concert on Tuesday night is at Freedom Square. <BR/><BR/>Unfortunately the FEER articles seem to be only accessible by subscribers, but thanks for pointing them out. I can hunt them down in the library.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13061413827755873948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-29901150186793849452008-12-08T23:31:00.001+08:002008-12-08T23:31:00.001+08:00Bejesus! is that the same J. Copper of "Taiwan, N...Bejesus! is that the same J. Copper of "Taiwan, Nation State or Province?" - my first introduction to the beautiful isle ...sad sad sadAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-82886065539266133982008-12-08T23:31:00.000+08:002008-12-08T23:31:00.000+08:00Freedom square, supposedlyFreedom square, <A HREF="http://action1106.blogspot.com/2008/12/blog-post_08.html" REL="nofollow">supposedly</A>Robert R.https://www.blogger.com/profile/12956389352825464115noreply@blogger.com