tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post581803550253618790..comments2023-10-22T18:25:39.688+08:00Comments on The View from Taiwan: Some Disturbing Thinking about Party DisciplineMichael Turtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-79654571144936099192010-12-31T19:53:47.461+08:002010-12-31T19:53:47.461+08:00I agree with Michael. The way councilors and lawma...I agree with Michael. The way councilors and lawmakers should be a matter of record; voters should be able to see what their representatives are voting for or against.<br /><br />Strangely, members of the British House of Commons vote publicly when it comes to making laws, but the balloting for the speakership is secret.Steven Crookhttp://crooksteven.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-19029895243200733172010-12-31T16:11:24.304+08:002010-12-31T16:11:24.304+08:00I think a politician's first loyalty is to him...I think a politician's first loyalty is to himself and no one should have any illusions about that. They are in the business of getting re-elected and the best way to do that is to represent the people who voted for you in a manner they want to be represented. Party discipline sounds nice but in practice is actually quite a horrid thing. Just ask the blue dog democrats how well that party discipline thing worked out for them. So why I may grind my teeth every time McCain goes out on one of his maverick kicks to media adulation, I have to understand that short of voting against him and convincing a lot of people to do so likewise, he's going to get re-elected. <br /><br />Ideas like these aren't taught along with adequate civics and economics lessons. Hence why people fall for the Ponzi schemes that characterize most social programs and politicians' promises. <br /><br />Then there's the ugly little fact that places that really enforce party discipline tend to shoot, imprison or do worse to those who go against party discipline.Okaminoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-55081456620988797182010-12-31T11:15:17.915+08:002010-12-31T11:15:17.915+08:00i think taipeitimes should have a section dedicate...i think taipeitimes should have a section dedicated to corruption policy, social policy and education policy. even if it's online.<br /><br />these discussions are so piece meal lacking the perception of critical mass.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14680069333426826313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-82921237488476487242010-12-30T23:30:00.706+08:002010-12-30T23:30:00.706+08:00The obvious reason for secret ballots in a procedu...The obvious reason for secret ballots in a procedural vote of this nature is to protect the corrupt. If votes are secret no one can know whose votes were purchased. The solution is, as you note, open ballots. <br /><br />MichaelMichael Turtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-50181239301943154082010-12-30T23:04:38.648+08:002010-12-30T23:04:38.648+08:00I've been thinking about similar issues as wel...I've been thinking about similar issues as well. If it was meant to be a secret ballot, then why were there "observers" from the party?<br /><br />I found it ridiculous that the KMT Taipei City caucuses had to give their fingerprints in order to identify the "black sheep." However, ain't this quite a parallel issue with the presence of an observer at the scene of an anonymous election?<br /><br />Your analogy of "procedural election," does make sense. The voters would want the representative to be in line with the party, unless otherwise.<br /><br />If that's the case, wouldn't it make more sense to open these "procedural election" to the public, so the voters would know "clearly" whether their respective counselors have follow their will?Hanshttp://harnh.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.com