tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post4503755442745012670..comments2023-10-22T18:25:39.688+08:00Comments on The View from Taiwan: Have the Strawberries Found Their Voice?Michael Turtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-56245508877597888282012-08-06T00:11:02.256+08:002012-08-06T00:11:02.256+08:00@Robert Scott Kelly
Geography, my dear Watson.@Robert Scott Kelly<br /><br />Geography, my dear Watson.blobOfNeuronsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-41949356138017011532012-08-05T11:44:49.970+08:002012-08-05T11:44:49.970+08:00The organizers of these youth protests are not try...The organizers of these youth protests are not trying to appear neutral, they are trying not to be associated with the pan green protests. The developers are trying to paint them as nothing more than the usual pan green protesters in order to discredit them. The young people don't want to be associated with the foul mouthed ah mas bussed in from the countryside to throw rocks and insults at the police.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-81148060131349519002012-08-05T07:59:08.610+08:002012-08-05T07:59:08.610+08:00Off topic, but another good Taiwan history find: N...Off topic, but another good Taiwan history find: <a href="http://www.nationalgeographicstock.com/" rel="nofollow">National Geographic Stockart</a> type in "Taiwan Formosa" and you will find 72 old images. (link also at <a href="http://taipics.com/links.php" rel="nofollow">taipics.com</a>)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-29592705622418745652012-08-05T01:10:23.511+08:002012-08-05T01:10:23.511+08:00Anon, wrote:
"For the next generation, we ar...Anon, wrote:<br /><br />"For the next generation, we are all Taiwanese."<br /><br />Really? In what way? There is no Taiwan state and the UN recognizes this land as a province of China. Your own government recognizes you as members of Han sub-ethnic groups, and your culture as Chinese with Taiwanese characteristics. So really, what does being Taiwanese mean? The one political movement that would give it real meaning you have said your generation holds in contempt. And by doing it seems to me you pretty much ensure that the other party, which will continue to ensure that identity is nothing but a warm fuzzy feeling, will stay in power.Robert Scott Kellyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17790139614002283723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-84980362994241134902012-08-05T01:05:17.944+08:002012-08-05T01:05:17.944+08:00Do they really know who they are? I wonder. Is it ...Do they really know who they are? I wonder. Is it really a good thing in the long run that they are "...avoiding discussion of the Blue-Green divide and papering over those tribal identities with silence.."?<br /><br />Their generation didn't pop up out of nowhere. The relative freedom they enjoy today came as a result of several previous generations of conflict. To close the book and agree to just pretend that that did not happen is hardly a solid foundation to build a movement upon, especially if social justice is to be valued.<br /><br />How can they "know who they are"? As a result of many factors, they have ended up with a very confused sense of who they are. They are very intentionally taught to be confused as to where "their nation" is, where it's borders lie, what notions of culture or history these borders are based upon, etc. What is different between the "national history" taught to Taiwanese students and the "national history" for PRC students? Is it simply two versions of the same basic narrative?<br /><br />Anybody here with kids in a Taiwan middle school? Are they explicitly taught anywhere in their civics classes that their sovereignty and legitimacy as a nation lies in the fact that they are a multi-party democracy with civil rights and rule of law? Or would that be too overtly "political"? Is sovereignty just based on race, culture, the three principals, and the "5000 years of culture" stuff?<br /><br />Yes, there is a certain "not-" identity, as in "Taiwanese, not Chinese", but the question is exactly where those feelings of localized identity and demands for justice will (or can) lead-- if those same people are decidedly intent on "not going there" as far as making the hard choices as to which political party they are supporting.<br /><br />It's fun to organize protests and sit-ins on a case-by-case basis on various issues that pop up, but that doesn't lead to anything practical if it does not translate into direct pressure on the legislature. It's great to say "we are neutral", but that usually also means that your demands are neutralized.John Scottnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-44041762035176794482012-08-05T00:01:23.137+08:002012-08-05T00:01:23.137+08:00Their concerns are mostly economic, they have been...Their concerns are mostly economic, they have been let down badly by both the KMT and DPP with worsening wages, poor work conditions, increasing costs. They are learning from travel that other places have more opportunities and easier to make money. They are unfairly denigrated at lazy and unorganized but they simply have got a raw deal in terms of politics and economic opportunities. If I was a youth in Taiwan I would have no love for DPP or KMT either. They wouldn't represent me but rather their older voting base and their corporate cronies.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-46902771980440820492012-08-04T22:29:24.044+08:002012-08-04T22:29:24.044+08:00This is something the TI elite will never come to ...<b>This is something the TI elite will never come to terms with.</b><br /><br />LOL.Michael Turtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-67688523297674196412012-08-04T22:03:13.526+08:002012-08-04T22:03:13.526+08:00How many times have you seen a Taiwanese young per...How many times have you seen a Taiwanese young person roll their eyes when their parents or grandparents complain about the "mainlanders"? Tribalism doesn't resonate with Taiwanese youth. Their identities were not formed in the Japanese era and they don't view their peers whose grandparents came from mainland China as another foreign colonization. For the next generation, we are all Taiwanese. This is something the TI elite will never come to terms with.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-61709179005954535512012-08-04T18:19:52.857+08:002012-08-04T18:19:52.857+08:00The so-called strawberries have always known where...<b>The so-called strawberries have always known where they stand and what they hold important. They look at the major political parties as two sides of the same coin - both corrupt and unrepresentative.</b><br /><br />Yes, that is what they always say. KMT propaganda has been very effective in that regard. That is another reason they choose social justice, because they don't want to violate the purity of their idealism with the dirtiness of party politics. But if you don't get your hands dirty, you can't grow anything. <br /><br />MichaelMichael Turtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-55191612367071876572012-08-04T16:10:18.194+08:002012-08-04T16:10:18.194+08:00I think it's an interesting comparison. What t...I think it's an interesting comparison. What the phone hacking scandal has been revealing in the UK is that both major parties were obsessed with courting the favour of Murdoch and that he had constant access to politicians at the highest level -- they came to him, literally in the case of Blair flying out to Australia in 1995.<br /><br />My impression is that in Taiwan the media divide along party lines rather more.nickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04587042453618184698noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-68218776425087716802012-08-04T13:27:51.300+08:002012-08-04T13:27:51.300+08:00The so-called strawberries have always known where...The so-called strawberries have always known where they stand and what they hold important. They look at the major political parties as two sides of the same coin - both corrupt and unrepresentative.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-15528706586346464762012-08-04T11:01:52.839+08:002012-08-04T11:01:52.839+08:00Maybe. But it would be hard to make an argument th...Maybe. But it would be hard to make an argument that Murdoch et al serve a politically subversive purpose. The USA is in no danger of being taken over by a government that backs Murdoch and his pals.Tommyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13552370490869601403noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-44948961974823438692012-08-03T22:54:29.744+08:002012-08-03T22:54:29.744+08:00China's Want Want Corp control over multi medi...China's Want Want Corp control over multi media and the manipulation of politics is really no different from that of the Murdoch, Packer and Fairfax dynasties of Ex Australia but now of the USA. They have been playing political and financial games for decades. One could say that "Ah, but they are in a democratic country" but it still has not stopped them from bending the rules and manipulating politicians and the public. Just look at the phone hacking scandals and the controls that management has over editors and editors of journalists..Geoffnoreply@blogger.com