tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post4298352025695544114..comments2023-10-22T18:25:39.688+08:00Comments on The View from Taiwan: Case No. 59213: China Specialists Don't Get TaiwanMichael Turtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-76638181132198690052015-02-26T23:05:44.974+08:002015-02-26T23:05:44.974+08:00China specialists will never get Taiwan. And wire ...China specialists will never get Taiwan. And wire services offering Taiwan related news from their Beijing desk office do not help either.<br /><br />The list of culprits is too long to apportion blame in a single comment. Rather, "what can Taiwan do to solve the issue?" should be tackled first.<br /><br />And Taiwan, in keeping with the history of its development should represent itself through its own Japanese language media, for a first. Next, the education system should give preeminence to its 国語 (kokugo). That is, the Japanese language as named from within a Japanese speaking territory.<br /><br />Last, Japanese ought to resume its status as Taiwan's official language and lingua franca.<br /><br />Have a better, less confrontational way to stave off China and all involved with China? Jerome Bessonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12958179528113268616noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-55526877779793853062015-02-26T13:23:14.758+08:002015-02-26T13:23:14.758+08:00I think these "China" Experts might do b...I think these "China" Experts might do better if they pay more attention to the Facebook/Blogs/Twitter. They need a tool that can filter/analyze Facebook posts to get a handle on the real mood of the population. Good Analysis need good data and right interpretation. When data is bad, the result will not be good. What is "right" interpretation that is open to debate but collecting the hard data is essential. True Taiwan expert only exist in Taiwan since he/she will have access to raw real-time data. That is why US setup embassy in every countries that matter. DPP needs to do a better job in getting the information out, but it is a difficult task. We remember last time when DPP people send a letter to a Washington DC based newsletter and get smack by a "former" State department official. Sometime I wonder if US States department deliberately try to distort the information coming from Taiwan to suite some specific narrative. When you distort the data too much and too long, things dose not ends well. <br /><br />At the end, effort needs to be focus on the things that have real impact and matter which is people of Taiwan. I think we are moving in the right direction. Rights dose not fall from sky. People needs to fight for it. When the time come, I hope US will do the right things and honor its commitment to democracy. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-31021122604822179832015-02-25T22:20:47.681+08:002015-02-25T22:20:47.681+08:00Another thing. I think that Nathan's problem i...<b>Another thing. I think that Nathan's problem is a mix of a belief in the sanctity of FTAs and a lack of blame of the Ma administration. I do not blame Chinese negotiators for seeking the best deal for their side. All trade negotiators from all countries attempt to do the same thing. Actually, the problem is that the Ma administration is too eager to accept an imperfect deal for political reasons. If you were a Chinese trade negotiator, wouldn't you exploit that?</b><br /><br />yes, I'd be really curious to hear what is actually said in those negotiations, and then what changes the Ma Administration makes.<br /><br />Michael Turtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-66697700337549093572015-02-25T22:18:46.780+08:002015-02-25T22:18:46.780+08:00Thanks Julian, those are good comments. Thanks Julian, those are good comments. Michael Turtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17974403961870976346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-87900860831627809762015-02-25T20:54:00.174+08:002015-02-25T20:54:00.174+08:00Another thing. I think that Nathan's problem i...Another thing. I think that Nathan's problem is a mix of a belief in the sanctity of FTAs and a lack of blame of the Ma administration. I do not blame Chinese negotiators for seeking the best deal for their side. All trade negotiators from all countries attempt to do the same thing. Actually, the problem is that the Ma administration is too eager to accept an imperfect deal for political reasons. If you were a Chinese trade negotiator, wouldn't you exploit that?<br /><br />As for the sanctity of FTAs, there are many academics who genuinely believe that they are good for all concerned. Actually, the problem is less the concept of free trade than it is the way in which FTAs are used. China does not sign FTAs that lead to tariff barriers. China only signs agreements that allow for protection of its interests. If one side enters negotiations with this mentality and the other side is less careful, you can have an FTA that is much more beneficial to one side than to another. In short, an FTA, does not necessarily result in "free trade", despite the name. Of course, China also does not sign FTAs with places it claims. It signs "arrangements" that lead to "closer cooperation" or "partnership" or something of the sort. After all, an "agreement" would give one side the right to refuse. Tommyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13552370490869601403noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-84301547092125709622015-02-25T14:00:45.456+08:002015-02-25T14:00:45.456+08:00I agree with Julian that it is possible many peopl...I agree with Julian that it is possible many people in the Chinese government including some of the decisions makers believe they're being generous to Taiwan. For one thing, as Michael Turton points out their are benefits to certain Taiwanese people - it's just that those Taiwanese people tend to be the rich rather than the mainstream. But if you're a Chinese official which Taiwanese do you meet and interact with? Which Taiwanese do you learn about when you look at how the Taiwanese economy is being run? <br /><br />Also, I would imagine that there is some disconnect between what many Chinese leaders want or say should happen and what actually happens. There is money involved, after all, and Chinese are certainly not immune to corruption. Speaking of which, a class of wealthy individuals and wealthier companies has developed in China. I have to imagine these individuals and interests have a say (behind the scenes of course) in setting policy just as they do in America. It would not surprise me to see different groups within the government acting at cross-purposes on foreign economic matters as some try to act on ideology while other serve special interests.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11022381054458476229noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-81913182297252822832015-02-25T12:14:44.618+08:002015-02-25T12:14:44.618+08:00Has Mr. Nathan ever once visited Taiwan? This is n...Has Mr. Nathan ever once visited Taiwan? This is not much better than the usual rubbish penned in Beijing by the usual 'Greater China' correspondents who never venture further the lobby bar of their 5-star hotel.lesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-74174288531475233342015-02-25T11:54:30.277+08:002015-02-25T11:54:30.277+08:00Sounds like all these analysts need to talk to Lee...Sounds like all these analysts need to talk to Lee Teng-hui. I imagine they've heard of him.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-35626434845165522372015-02-25T11:50:26.298+08:002015-02-25T11:50:26.298+08:00The history of China Studies plays into this pheno...The history of China Studies plays into this phenomenon. Much of the way information in regard to Taiwan is received is through a China-centered paradigm that was established during the Cold War. Two of the most instrumental schools on China Studies or East Asian studies were from Harvard under John King Fairbank; an uncompromising sinologist who helped create the myth of a monolithic, mysterious Chineseness that could defy the laws of physics... or at least the analytical frameworks provided to understand and assess other countries. The other major school of thought was the Stanford East Asian Studies programs that sent out postmodernist anthropologists in the 60's and 70's to study Taiwan as an analog to a closed China. Students from both schools, and their academic progeny, have gone out to become some of the loudest voices in the room. Viewing Taiwan through a China-centered paradigm always fails to account for the Taiwanese experience and how that experience has transformed Taiwan from root to shoot. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-51926692010511896252015-02-25T03:43:31.355+08:002015-02-25T03:43:31.355+08:00Nice piece Michael. The other problem is that too ...Nice piece Michael. The other problem is that too few who do get it bother to pursue these experts (the same with media outlets who perpetuate the usual mythology of "China and Taiwan split in 19whatever")to address their "misunderstanding" of Taiwan. Nathan is easy to reach, and so are most academics via e-mail... <br /><br />CheersAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-8819616422548414892015-02-24T22:04:48.720+08:002015-02-24T22:04:48.720+08:00Michael, thank you for calling a spade "a spa...Michael, thank you for calling a spade "a spade". Myself, being a retired US Army "China" Foreign Area Officer (aka China specialist), I have watched during many conferences and lectures, as well as during my days in the Pentagon, the so called China specialists (academics and US Government officials) just do NOT understand Taiwan nor did they actually research and study the history and dynamics of Taiwan. <br /><br />Please do not get me started on a rant. I could write a book on the stupidity of Washington DC and East Coast academics. What is also funny is 99% of the active serving officials both military and non-military have no idea that once upon a time, the United States had US military bases here. Oh, my head hurts just thinking about this stupidity -- time for a beer.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01121690711599444422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10698887.post-66668011446335615842015-02-24T21:41:31.772+08:002015-02-24T21:41:31.772+08:00You're being a little too hard on Nathan here,...You're being a little too hard on Nathan here, especially on the first point. Of course Beijing says and probably believes it's being generous to Taiwan. Surely, that fiction dominates in minds of PRC tourists who come to Taiwan and Hong Kong, too. How often have you heard them say how lucky Taiwan is to have them here spending their hard-earned money (usually in reaction to criticism for obnoxious behavior). It's even worse in HK, from what I hear. And Nathan's surely right that this the mark of a materialistic society. As you say, Nathan doesn't understand the actual situation. Beijing and KMT propaganda is partly responsible for this along with the failures of the Taiwanese media, lack of convincing analysis by Taiwanese economists and public policy groups, and so on. But they're all up against a powerful onslaught of false information. ON the 2nd point, you're right to take Nathan to task. Yet don't forget that he's one of the most sympathetic China watchers to Taiwan's political achievements. His work on Chinese democracy is a classic and he's not timid about criticising Beijing for their shortcomings. So it's deeply unfortunate that he's allowed himself to speculate so extensively about a future that no one can see. Still, if someone could get to him with your arguments, I expect he'd take then onboard. The general problem is breaking the mindset that Taiwan has no future as a sovereign territory and that it's people are not sturdy enough to resist the blandishments of the world's largest economy. Sad to say, this is a mindset that is a firm grip on the outside world, even relatively informed scholars like Nathan.Julianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10544888878269982586noreply@blogger.com